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Post by Jeff on Sept 14, 2010 17:03:36 GMT -5
I posted another thread about the DOI not being in widespread circulation in the 1820's. I had failed to neglect newspapers but I still stand by that.
Trust me, I want to believe. I really do.
However, while reading about the DOI it was stated that the ink had started to fade and by the 1870's many of the names were illegible. Assuming that Beale wrote with normal ink, it is easy to see that a lot of the numbers would most likely have faded or at least been illegible. Do you really think that many numbers would remain perfectly clear from 1820 to 1885?
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Post by Rebel KGC on Sept 15, 2010 9:26:17 GMT -5
;D HIGH-TEST COFFEE! (Regular... STARBUCKS!) Jeff, gonna clarify; Thom. J. Beale supposedy used the DOI in @ 1819, during the FIRST trip to Bedford County, Va.... and PROBABLY wrote out the "numbers/codes" at Buford's in Monvale, Va., at THAT time. THEN, Hazlewood of Montvale, Va. had a copy of the Beale Code(s) (numbers), which were in the MORRISS box (hand-written), and TYPED by Ward, with SOME "minor" changes. Innis, in 1964 released the "story" for the FIRST time, to the general public; prior to that the Friedmans (ciphers/codes busters) tried to decipher 'em, w/o "luck"... NO KEY. I will let OTHERS further clarify "details". I focus MAINLY on 1885, and the "mysteries" of Lynchburg, Va. and the mountains of NorthEast Bedford County, "up" from Lynchburg, Va. ;D (SUNNY out...).
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Post by TOMm on Sept 23, 2010 22:45:11 GMT -5
hi gents
i think i ve got something here i don't know whether or not the ink was faded but i can prove that the Beale codes from the pamphlet Ward sold is misleading but why?? but i still say that they were commissioned to be printed after all the signers passed away and i think what i have can give some credence to that theory in other words i can prove some deceit .. now if any of you are going to be in Wva As i will be this whole fall, i will be in Central WV on rt 20 and ill show you what you are missing i will be in and out of that area give me a temp email and ill tell when and where i will be there and why i am doing this is give myself some credibility as to what i claim as proof and then some crow might be served for dinner and by the way gents i have proof that ONE Mr fisher was in my area looking for that stuff and thats documented and if any of you know him ask if he was ever fired upon by an old hermit (remember my hermit story ) i am sure he will remember. now just as the pamphlet is misleading so is my last statement but true i will now show where it is miss leading <is>IN MY AREA true but Miss leading cause it seems and sounds like my area is Central WV rt 20 and it sounds and seems if the hermits doing the firing was there and thats not true but miss leading but he did fire upon Mr fisher. whats this have to do with anything well ever since i have been posting on this board i have been say hey fellers it taint in VA that thatchee be a hankerin fer ,so lets takea voat From whom of you that could prove any thing about this cheer code would give up such info maybe i should not . i can show one not well name i can show two well known treasures that are priceless in the deciphering i can show how to decipher some of the codes but not all but ifn i do dat then what fer cause whom can i trust but myself i have lost treasure by being Mr nice guy i jist don't know what to do i need ta du sum morr pondrwren upon dha subject at hand. i reckon meby. oh by the way gents Mr Jefferson etal (and others ) also wrote in phonetics such as the word CHUSE (choose ) in the D.O.I. and by the way i dont keep any of that info on my hard drive. didnt Ward say that there were no errors well thats true but only if the errors were intentionally done to mis lead cause we all know that there are errors Thur-out the entire pamphlet has any one took the time and listed The ERRORS The Double Nouns The Double Pro NOUNS (Pronounced To be gold ) The Number Of Verbs The Number Of A B C etc., The Number of Caves ( think at least 2) The Number of miles 500 & 4 etc The Number of years 2 & 10 etc. The Number of Months (total) The Number of Lines in letter The number of Virgina's mentioned The number of Hotels The number of Cities The number of Names The number of Mr OR Mrs The Number of Animals lion bears horses32, BUFLO(NO dogs why? ) Find ingit (Had in Find ingit ) Location Form a regular military ) Location High in a cleft ) Location Asw--ell as ASA name ) Location Taswell,LEWIS Saltw (freeby) Silver ) Location Gold ) Location
Later TOMm
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Post by Rebel KGC on Sept 24, 2010 4:50:57 GMT -5
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Post by doverturtle on Sept 24, 2010 8:00:11 GMT -5
I know you guys just dismiss everything that TOMm writes, but there are some things he discusses that do make some sense to me. There are many things about the Beale codes that do seem like they could be misleading. What lead to the "accidental" discovery that the DOI could decode the second message? Why put the general area of the treasure (i.e. Bedford county) in the message that is easiest to decipher? If I didn't live so far away from West Virginia I would take TOMm up on his offer, but I live in York County, PA. (By the way, PA also has a Bedford County. The decoded message does not say Bedford County, Virginia. I do sometimes wonder if that omission is to deliberately mislead people into searching for the treasure in the wrong state.) I guess this may all be cleared up if Beale is successful in his recovery efforts, although I have not heard any updates in quite a while...
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Post by Rebel KGC on Sept 24, 2010 9:38:23 GMT -5
dt, let TOMm, et al tell us what they find. The front page of the BEALE PAPERS (aka "JOB PRINT") CLEARLY sez "Treasure hidden in Bedford County, VIRGINIA...''. AND! If ya wanna go the "deciphered route"; "... four miles from BUFORD'S..." ;D Got a BUFORD'S up there in PA?
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Post by TOMm on Sept 24, 2010 20:36:54 GMT -5
Hi Gents
Number two says EDIT UR CY FOR BURDS IX=9 FAYEET STREET FLOUR MILLe fromm
and besides beale needed a barber OR babour country cause his hare (rabbit) was worn longer/itude than was the cus TOM
BEDFORD INn REDFORDS INN IN BEDFORD Vir GIN IA MASON DIX LINE was moved and put bedford county in PA near fort louden VA
when you edit bufords you get BURDS ix=9
2 is a code inside a code misleading THINK= TWO ,TWICe, DOUBLE ,TWA,twin , >Twain,<ETCetra do it a gain = twice =2 6 FEET BELOW THE SURFACE= SOUND MARK TWAIN common system of measurement on river boat water depth.(ground is mis leading)..... to save weight Well yes on a boat you had better ,budget weight all ships were reffered to as ladies -misleading also even when the vessels (Theres that word) carried a male name, ie= BEDFORD i have deposited in the **c**SEA of xxxxxxxxxx
100% conjecture
TOMm
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Post by Rebel KGC on Sept 25, 2010 5:06:21 GMT -5
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Post by Jeff on Sept 27, 2010 22:56:14 GMT -5
;D HIGH-TEST COFFEE! (Regular... STARBUCKS!) Jeff, gonna clarify; Thom. J. Beale supposedy used the DOI in @ 1819, during the FIRST trip to Bedford County, Va.... and PROBABLY wrote out the "numbers/codes" at Buford's in Monvale, Va., at THAT time. THEN, Hazlewood of Montvale, Va. had a copy of the Beale Code(s) (numbers), which were in the MORRISS box (hand-written), and TYPED by Ward, with SOME "minor" changes. Innis, in 1964 released the "story" for the FIRST time, to the general public; prior to that the Friedmans (ciphers/codes busters) tried to decipher 'em, w/o "luck"... NO KEY. I will let OTHERS further clarify "details". I focus MAINLY on 1885, and the "mysteries" of Lynchburg, Va. and the mountains of NorthEast Bedford County, "up" from Lynchburg, Va. ;D (SUNNY out...). So when were they typed? 1860's? Sooner? Later? Do we even know other than the first time they showed up in the 1885? My point is that the numbers most likely would have faded. Nothing in your answer refutes that. And TOMm, stop derailing the thread.
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Post by Rebel KGC on Sept 28, 2010 5:17:32 GMT -5
;D HIGH-TEST! YOU are assuming, the BC's were handwritten in ink... we don't know that; MAY have been written/printed in PENCIL. NOW! I DID make a small error in that I THOUGHT B. Ward typed N. Hazlewood's copies (8 pages); he didn't... it was Clayton L. Hart in 1897, well after the 1885 "JOB PRINT" ( bealesolved.tripod.com/id10.html ). Doubt if Thom. J. Beale travelled around with "ink tools"; COULD have gotten it from Buford, of course. FIRST, you were focused on the DOI... what is REALLY yer concern? NEVER "said" Ward typed the BC's from Robert MORRISS. "JOB PRINT" had to be Type-Set in Lynchburg, Va. in 1885; hand-written copies of BC's were in a box from 1819 - 1840's or so... relying on memory here... will correct when I can get the file... or just "google"... "Beale Papers", the ONLY "source" for the NUMBER CODE(S).
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Post by Jeff on Sept 30, 2010 16:10:38 GMT -5
I was referring to the DOI simply because if the ink was fading on it after 30 years it surely would have faded on the original beale papers. You mentioned it may have been done in pencil. Have you ever seen pencil after 20 years?
My only point was that the codes from the time they were locked in the box to the time they were removed would have degraded considerably.
I haven't made up my mind one way or the other in regards to the codes being real or not. I simply try to look at it from different points of view.
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Post by beale on Sept 30, 2010 21:46:45 GMT -5
Jeff, I see no problem with the cipher papers being in the iron box for twenty years when Robert Morris opened it or even forty years later when the author said the cipher papers and the letters were placed into his hands. I might add the iron box was given to him also. Our original DOI is over 234 years old, yes it has faded some but is still quite readable. The only concern I see is how many times the author handled the papers and rewrote them. He did say that every number of all three ciphers were in his mind in their exact order as he had memorized them. I worked on the cipher papers with my own copies and some of the ciphers were faded as you mentioned. I had some of the ciphers separated that should have been one cipher and some that should have been two ciphers I had them down as one cipher. But, when I went back to the original I could correct these mistakes. According to George Hart the original ciphers that were in the iron box were located in SE Roanoke with a member of the OTEY family and that is where Pauline Innis found them and carried them back to the Watergate Hotel in Washington, D.C. Since she has now passed away I have tried to locate her estate to find the iron box and bring it back to our area but I have had no success. Pauline Innis did have the iron box with all the original letters and papers. She was the writer that said all that was left in the iron box were two small pieces of paper that looked like a torn receipt. I telephoned her one night and asked her was that all that was in the iron box. She asked me to telephone back in two or three days and she would check for me. I telephoned her back and she said that was all there was. I know she had the iron box of Robert Morris' I just do not know where it is in Washington, D.C. with her estate. As for the two pieces of paper, it is a pictural drawing of the stones around the vault area. The area is about sixty feet wide and one hundred feet long in a "J" formation in the mountains of Bedford County. That is all I can say on that subject due to confidentiality agreements signed years ago. As you know the letter "J" is Spanish, French and English for a symbol of treasure and treasure is buried at one end of a straight line of the letter "J" sometimes they would use stones and sometimes they would plant trees in the same formation.
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corey
New Member
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Post by corey on Oct 19, 2010 16:27:07 GMT -5
The torn receipt that beale mentions in the above post is depicted on the bottom of the webpage, bealesolved.tripod.com/id11.html The writing looks quite visible at the time it was imaged.
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Post by Rebel KGC on Feb 24, 2011 9:56:45 GMT -5
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